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Adrian Penisoara
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 21 Mar 2002
Posts: 3
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 Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2002 11:09 pm Post subject:
Re: Help needed: ALTQ integration into FreeBSD
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Hi,
Thank you all for your replies. I will keep track of all the
mentioned issues.
In the mean time I will be waiting for Mr. Kenjiro Cho to return and
have a chat with him. I will keep you posted with my/our progress.
Thanks!
Ady (@freebsd.ady.ro)
_______________________________________________________________________
| Programming in BASIC causes brain damage. |
| (Edsger Wybe Dijkstra) |
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Kenjiro Cho
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 22 Mar 2002
Posts: 1
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| Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2002 5:51 am Post subject:
Re: Help needed: ALTQ integration into FreeBSD
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| Quote: | ady> Having the prerequisite agreement of the FreeBSD core team I'm
ady> delighted to announce my intention of putting the basis of a "ALTQ
ady> framework integration into FreeBSD" project.
Have you ever contact to Cho-san, the author of ALTQ? He is also a
FreeBSD committer (kjc@FreeBSD.org), and may willing to help you if he
have enough time to do.
|
I'm now at IETF and leaving Minneapolis tomorrow morning.
I'll talk to Ady when I get back.
(yes, I do have an idea on how to integrate fine-grained locking into
ALTQ.)
-Kenjiro
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Terry Lambert
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 19 Mar 2002
Posts: 434
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| Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2002 5:07 am Post subject:
Re: Help needed: ALTQ integration into FreeBSD
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Makoto Matsushita wrote:
| Quote: | Have you ever contact to Cho-san, the author of ALTQ? He is also a
FreeBSD committer (kjc@FreeBSD.org), and may willing to help you if he
have enough time to do.
ALTQ implementation is already integrated into KAME; maybe KAME guys
can help you. I've heard a few days ago that a new FreeBSD committer,
suz (from KAME team itself), is approved by core, but his account on
freefall is *not* created (I dunno why but it's true) so he can't do
his work (sigh).
|
Personally, I'm a little "gun shy" about KAME integration
right now.
The IPv4 IPSEC code has this nasty habit of reserving space
for the IPSEC for non-IPSEC connections. This drops the
maximum number of connections supportable by a given amount
of RAM by a factor of 4 or more.
I understand the need to alloc memory for the stuff when the
connection is actually an IPSEC connection, but as it is, not
using IPSEC, and just having the crap in your kernel has the
bad effect on the maximum number of connections.
I would really hate to see something else come in that was
not conditionalized on it actually being used. 8-(.
-- Terry
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Robert Watson
*nix forums Guru Wannabe
Joined: 22 Mar 2002
Posts: 218
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| Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2002 2:11 am Post subject:
Re: Help needed: ALTQ integration into FreeBSD
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On Fri, 22 Mar 2002, Andre Oppermann wrote:
| Quote: | Having the prerequisite agreement of the FreeBSD core team I'm
delighted to announce my intention of putting the basis of a "ALTQ
framework integration into FreeBSD" project.
Does this mean the core team has approved the integration of ALTQ into
FreeBSD-current?
|
The core team has neither approved nor rejected anything. However, there
were a number of us who said "Yeah, we've been hoping someone would make
this happen". Obviously, any final integration decision would be based on
having a much better idea about the positive and negative aspects of the
work. One of the recommendations we made was that this work definitely be
done on 5.0-CURRENT, and take the fine-grained SMP work into account. The
other recommendation we made was that this be done in careful coordination
with others working on it: there's a lot of interest in ALTQ, and existing
porting work.
Robert N M Watson FreeBSD Core Team, TrustedBSD Project
robert@fledge.watson.org NAI Labs, Safeport Network Services
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Makoto Matsushita
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 21 Mar 2002
Posts: 9
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| Posted: Thu Mar 21, 2002 11:43 pm Post subject:
Re: Help needed: ALTQ integration into FreeBSD
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ady> Having the prerequisite agreement of the FreeBSD core team I'm
ady> delighted to announce my intention of putting the basis of a "ALTQ
ady> framework integration into FreeBSD" project.
Have you ever contact to Cho-san, the author of ALTQ? He is also a
FreeBSD committer (kjc@FreeBSD.org), and may willing to help you if he
have enough time to do.
ALTQ implementation is already integrated into KAME; maybe KAME guys
can help you. I've heard a few days ago that a new FreeBSD committer,
suz (from KAME team itself), is approved by core, but his account on
freefall is *not* created (I dunno why but it's true) so he can't do
his work (sigh).
-- -
Makoto `MAR' Matsushita
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Terry Lambert
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 19 Mar 2002
Posts: 434
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| Posted: Thu Mar 21, 2002 10:44 pm Post subject:
Re: Help needed: ALTQ integration into FreeBSD
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Andre Oppermann wrote:
| Quote: | The plan is to first research and identify all issues with the currect
networking stack in FreeBSD (1 month).
|
Here are some that I think need to be addressed.
o Can't make more that 64k outbound connections, without
heroic measures, even with multiple IP addresses.
o Exponential slowdown because of in_pcblookup_hash,
at some "cliff" equalt to the number of buckets
(should use a btree or some other scalable structure)
o TCP/IP timers go into timeout wheel out of expiration
order, so expiration has to traverse entire list; as
most expire before they are e3ver called, this is all
dead weight. Should use a per interval list for some
small number of granular intervals; adding adds to the
end of the list, so expiration can limit traversal to
the first entry where the timeout is not expired, and
not examine the rest of the outstanding timers.
o Jon Lemon's patches don't deal with receiver livelock
in the case that the livelock occurs higher in the
stack (e.g. in the accept of connections). LRP, per
Peter Druschel @ Rice University, is a better approach,
overall.
o Luigi Rizzo's patches only deal with fixed interval
scheduling when polling is on, and so degrade radically
with load outside the prediction parameters (e.g. NFS
processing vs. packet forwarding vs. user space app.).
Using queue depth to user space, and weighted fair share
is a better scheduling policy that assures better
performance, per Jeff Mogul, DEC Western Research
Laboratories.
o Fast retransmit (ala TCP Reno) has a number of problems
during Fast Recovery that lead to "yoyo mode" (peristaltic
congestion). Rate Halving, per Hoe @ Pittsburg Supercomputing
Center at Carnegie Mellon is a better approach.
-- Terry
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Terry Lambert
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 19 Mar 2002
Posts: 434
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| Posted: Thu Mar 21, 2002 10:10 pm Post subject:
Re: Help needed: ALTQ integration into FreeBSD
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Julian did some nice QOS work at Whistle that he always shushes
me when I mention it. You should beat him over the head for it.
It's not necessarily miscible with AltQ, but it had the effect
of controlling the amount of buffer space taken on the remote
end of a slow link, so that a single transfer over an impedence
mismatched link didn't stop all the other traffic, regardless of
the QOS settings. From what I remember, AltQ had this problem,
and no reasonable way to resolve it.
-- Terry
Adrian Penisoara wrote:
| Quote: |
Hi,
Having the prerequisite agreement of the FreeBSD core team I'm
delighted to announce my intention of putting the basis of a "ALTQ
framework integration into FreeBSD" project.
The current set target is "porting" the sources of the ALTQ project
(ALTQ 3.1 is available for the 4.5-RELEASE branch) to FreeBSD-current.
This is certainly not a easy nor simple task and I surely don't have all
the skills needed right now, so I'm going to need help. I'm looking for
a mentor (or more) with FreeBSD core networking knowledge and, if
possible, with commit privileges to the right spots. If you know such a
person or if you are one please contact me.
Also, anybody interested to discuss, contribute or help in any other
way is very welcomed to contact me.
Reference:
ALTQ project home
http://www.csl.sony.co.jp/person/kjc/kjc/software.html
Thank you very much,
Adrian Penisoara
Ady (@freebsd.ady.ro)
_______________________________________________________________________
| Programming in BASIC causes brain damage. |
| (Edsger Wybe Dijkstra) |
To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org
with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message
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Andre Oppermann
*nix forums addict
Joined: 21 Mar 2002
Posts: 55
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| Posted: Thu Mar 21, 2002 10:05 pm Post subject:
Re: Help needed: ALTQ integration into FreeBSD
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Adrian Penisoara wrote:
| Quote: |
Hi,
Having the prerequisite agreement of the FreeBSD core team I'm
delighted to announce my intention of putting the basis of a "ALTQ
framework integration into FreeBSD" project.
|
Does this mean the core team has approved the integration of ALTQ
into FreeBSD-current?
| Quote: | The current set target is "porting" the sources of the ALTQ project
(ALTQ 3.1 is available for the 4.5-RELEASE branch) to FreeBSD-current.
This is certainly not a easy nor simple task and I surely don't have all
the skills needed right now, so I'm going to need help. I'm looking for
a mentor (or more) with FreeBSD core networking knowledge and, if
possible, with commit privileges to the right spots. If you know such a
person or if you are one please contact me.
|
Myself and a collegue of mine are starting to work on a couple of
FreeBSD networking related projects from next month on. ALTQ is one of
the things on our plate but I think we would have got to it not before
summer. We want to overhaul a couple of things in the *BSD networking
stack (IP but not TCP/UDP) which are out of date in these days. Part
of that is to address many issues Garret Wollman has identified in an
email on -net many moons ago. Some things that will be addressed are
for example the routing table (old and fat structure, policy routing),
IPIP tunneling abstractions (GRE etc.) and some more things.
The plan is to first research and identify all issues with the currect
networking stack in FreeBSD (1 month). Then to research and identify
possible new structures/framworks and to publish a research paper with
our findings and recommendations (1-2 month). From then on discussion
and implementation will begin.
This work is funded by my company (Internet Business Solutions AG)
because we want to use a FreeBSD kernel in our high-performance and
special purpose routing device by Winter 2002. My goal is to submit
as much code as possible of the non-special stuff into FreeBSD (as
I've done in the past with RADIUS for Brian's ppp and some Netgraph
stuff and the OLDCARD in -stable last year (I organized funding for
Brian, Julian and Warner to work on it)).
--
Andre
| Quote: | Also, anybody interested to discuss, contribute or help in any other
way is very welcomed to contact me.
Reference:
ALTQ project home
http://www.csl.sony.co.jp/person/kjc/kjc/software.html
Thank you very much,
Adrian Penisoara
Ady (@freebsd.ady.ro)
_______________________________________________________________________
| Programming in BASIC causes brain damage. |
| (Edsger Wybe Dijkstra) |
To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org
with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message
|
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Adrian Penisoara
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 21 Mar 2002
Posts: 3
|
| Posted: Thu Mar 21, 2002 8:54 pm Post subject:
Help needed: ALTQ integration into FreeBSD
|
|
|
Hi,
Having the prerequisite agreement of the FreeBSD core team I'm
delighted to announce my intention of putting the basis of a "ALTQ
framework integration into FreeBSD" project.
The current set target is "porting" the sources of the ALTQ project
(ALTQ 3.1 is available for the 4.5-RELEASE branch) to FreeBSD-current.
This is certainly not a easy nor simple task and I surely don't have all
the skills needed right now, so I'm going to need help. I'm looking for
a mentor (or more) with FreeBSD core networking knowledge and, if
possible, with commit privileges to the right spots. If you know such a
person or if you are one please contact me.
Also, anybody interested to discuss, contribute or help in any other
way is very welcomed to contact me.
Reference:
ALTQ project home
http://www.csl.sony.co.jp/person/kjc/kjc/software.html
Thank you very much,
Adrian Penisoara
Ady (@freebsd.ady.ro)
_______________________________________________________________________
| Programming in BASIC causes brain damage. |
| (Edsger Wybe Dijkstra) |
To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org
with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message |
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