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Bob Koehler
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 1078
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 Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 3:02 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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In article <DTiotGxQ0bj6-pn2-iYdPzQwuOZOm@dave2_os2.home.ours>, "Dave Weatherall" <djw-nothere@nospam.nohow> writes:
| Quote: |
Ok, I'll bite, what makes a logo Java compatible?  )
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A trip to Starbucks? |
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Bob Koehler
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 1078
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| Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 3:01 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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In article <opsl9a2qmfzgicya@hyrrokkin>, "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes:
| Quote: | Isn't the basic difference that passwds are transmitted unencrypted with
telnet? Aside from this, it would seem that breakins have the same
probability of success, independent of whether you use telnet or ssh
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The basic difference is that everything is transmitted encrypted with
SSH. Passwords, of course, are a prime concern, but the data may
also be of interest.
The increase in attacks upon opening SSH is probably a social issue. |
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david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk
*nix forums Guru Wannabe
Joined: 16 May 2005
Posts: 205
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| Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 1:09 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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In article <opsl9a2qmfzgicya@hyrrokkin>, "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes:
| Quote: | On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:22:17 -0800, DeanW <dean.woodward@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:02:50 +0000 (UTC), Bradford J. Hamilton
Isn't the basic difference that passwds are transmitted unencrypted with
telnet? Aside from this, it would seem that breakins have the same
probability of success, independent of whether you use telnet or ssh
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A SSH brute force password guesser brutessh2 was published in August 2004
which a lot of script kiddies seem to be using see
http://www.k-otik.com/exploits/08202004.brutessh2.c.php
David Webb
Security team leader
CCSS
Middlesex University
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Tom Linden
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 06 May 2002
Posts: 841
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| Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 12:21 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:09:03 +0000 (UTC), <david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk> wrote:
| Quote: | In article <opsl9a2qmfzgicya@hyrrokkin>, "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com
writes:
On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:22:17 -0800, DeanW <dean.woodward@gmail.com
wrote:
On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:02:50 +0000 (UTC), Bradford J. Hamilton
Isn't the basic difference that passwds are transmitted unencrypted with
telnet? Aside from this, it would seem that breakins have the same
probability of success, independent of whether you use telnet or ssh
A SSH brute force password guesser brutessh2 was published in August 2004
which a lot of script kiddies seem to be using see
http://www.k-otik.com/exploits/08202004.brutessh2.c.php
But if the site only allows three login tries per hour, it might take |
a long time.
| Quote: |
David Webb
Security team leader
CCSS
Middlesex University
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
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--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/ |
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Galen
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 22 Jul 2005
Posts: 49
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| Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 11:56 am Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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If the logo were made of silicon with a Java processor etched into it,
would that make the logo Java compatible?
:-D |
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JF Mezei
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Posts: 2556
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| Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 6:33 am Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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Dave Weatherall wrote:
| Quote: | You'll all be happy to know that the box has a Java Compatible logo on it.
:)
-Jeff
Ok, I'll bite, what makes a logo Java compatible? )
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It means it has been sanctioned by Sun.
What was it during the Compaq era that had been shipped with either a
Sun logo or a picture of Sun equipment on the box ? (it was VMS stuff inside). |
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Dave Weatherall
*nix forums Guru Wannabe
Joined: 27 Jul 2005
Posts: 108
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| Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 6:03 am Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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On Mon, 14 Feb 2005 15:41:37 UTC, "Jeff Goodwin"
<jgoodwin@maine.rrr-r.com> wrote:
| Quote: | My OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution arrived today.
You'll all be happy to know that the box has a Java Compatible logo on it.
:)
-Jeff
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Ok, I'll bite, what makes a logo Java compatible? )
--
Cheers - Dave W. |
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Chris Scheers
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 13 May 2005
Posts: 44
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 10:15 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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Larry Kilgallen wrote:
| Quote: | In article <37f2v8F5d11ivU1@individual.net>, Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com> writes:
Larry Kilgallen wrote:
In article <cut288$dif$1@grandcanyon.binc.net>, hamilton@Encompasserve.org (Bradford J. Hamilton) writes:
The licenses will work with any VMS release AFAIK (I don't know of many
hobbyists running VMS 6.2 and earlier, but I imagine they exist).
The licenses probably do not work on VMS V5.0 and V5.1.
They certainly do not work prior to VMS V5.0.
Then again, they aren't needed prior to VMS 5.0.
My MicroVMS 4.x distributions had an extra license element that had
to be applied to get the licensed number of users.
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Under MicroVMS 4.x, licensed users was handled by a version of
LOGINOUT.EXE which was patched for a particular number.
The license element which was distributed was actually an updated
LOGINOUT.EXE.
Actually, the LOGINOUT.EXE from regular VMS also worked very well under
MicroVMS. <grin>
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Chris Scheers, Applied Synergy, Inc.
Voice: 817-237-3360 Internet: chris@applied-synergy.com
Fax: 817-237-3074 |
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JF Mezei
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Posts: 2556
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 9:49 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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Dave Froble wrote:
| Quote: | If the object is being able to run VMS, then the licenses do work on
versions prior to V5.0. Not saying they actually do anything, but VMS
does run.
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Nop. On my all mighty Microvax II, VMS walks :-)
VMS may need a "key" prior to V 5.0, but applications didn't have any
licencing schemes before that.
One needs to remember that applications coming from post 5.0
environments wouldn't work on pre 5.0 since the image activator would
complain about missing shareable image (and probably lots of ident mismatchs). |
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Dave Froble
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Posts: 1172
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 9:35 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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Larry Kilgallen wrote:
| Quote: | In article <cut288$dif$1@grandcanyon.binc.net>, hamilton@Encompasserve.org (Bradford J. Hamilton) writes:
The licenses will work with any VMS release AFAIK (I don't know of many
hobbyists running VMS 6.2 and earlier, but I imagine they exist).
The licenses probably do not work on VMS V5.0 and V5.1.
They certainly do not work prior to VMS V5.0.
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If the object is being able to run VMS, then the licenses do work on
versions prior to V5.0. Not saying they actually do anything, but VMS
does run. |
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Dave Greenwood
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 27 May 2005
Posts: 25
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 9:25 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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In a previous article, DeanW <dean.woodward@gmail.com> wrote:
| Quote: | On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:55:28 -0800, Tom Linden <tom@kednos.com> wrote:
On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:22:17 -0800, DeanW <dean.woodward@gmail.com> wrote:
Supported or not, TCPIP 5.4 runs on 7.2-1 and comes with SSH.
Although I've had more breakin attempts since I opened up SSH
(averaging 4-5 a week) than I've ever had over telnet (um, zero, in 6+
years).
Isn't the basic difference that passwds are transmitted unencrypted with
telnet? Aside from this, it would seem that breakins have the same
probability of success, independent of whether you use telnet or ssh
Standard Telnet is open- anyone who plugs a sniffer into any segment
between point A and point B can see/read the traffic. It's
theoretically possible to take over a telnet session from somewhere in
the middle, though I don't know if it's been done in the wild. I do
know a telnet password has been captured via sniffing and used to
break into a system and raise some degree of havoc until they nailed
the hole shut again. (Local small-town ISP that has since disabled
telnet access.)
Our GUI environment uses telnet to communicate with the server, but we
use LGI callouts to verify users, thus avoiding the clear-text
password issue.
I'm guessing the SSH attempts are analogous to script kiddies, looking
for open SSH ports then throwing a list of username/password combos at
it that worked once, somewhere. It'd be interesting to see what
usernames they were trying, but as mentioned in another thread, SSH
doesn't like to give that information.
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A number of successful ssh breakins have been made in the last few
months using trojaned ssh clients. The clients just capture the
keystrokes, including legitimate usernames and passwords. The fact
that ssh encypts everything, not just the passwords, actually makes
it harder for the net cops to detect the resulting breakins.
Dave
--------------
Dave Greenwood Email: Greenwoodde@ORNL.GOV
Oak Ridge National Lab %STD-W-DISCLAIMER, I only speak for myself |
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DeanW
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 04 Feb 2005
Posts: 28
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 8:25 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:55:28 -0800, Tom Linden <tom@kednos.com> wrote:
| Quote: | On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:22:17 -0800, DeanW <dean.woodward@gmail.com> wrote:
Supported or not, TCPIP 5.4 runs on 7.2-1 and comes with SSH.
Although I've had more breakin attempts since I opened up SSH
(averaging 4-5 a week) than I've ever had over telnet (um, zero, in 6+
years).
Isn't the basic difference that passwds are transmitted unencrypted with
telnet? Aside from this, it would seem that breakins have the same
probability of success, independent of whether you use telnet or ssh
|
Standard Telnet is open- anyone who plugs a sniffer into any segment
between point A and point B can see/read the traffic. It's
theoretically possible to take over a telnet session from somewhere in
the middle, though I don't know if it's been done in the wild. I do
know a telnet password has been captured via sniffing and used to
break into a system and raise some degree of havoc until they nailed
the hole shut again. (Local small-town ISP that has since disabled
telnet access.)
Our GUI environment uses telnet to communicate with the server, but we
use LGI callouts to verify users, thus avoiding the clear-text
password issue.
I'm guessing the SSH attempts are analogous to script kiddies, looking
for open SSH ports then throwing a list of username/password combos at
it that worked once, somewhere. It'd be interesting to see what
usernames they were trying, but as mentioned in another thread, SSH
doesn't like to give that information. |
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Bradford J. Hamilton
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 11 Feb 2005
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 8:02 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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In article <42124f20$1@news.qgraph.com>, "Schroeder, AJ" <aj1@qg.com> writes:
!snip!
!
!The reason I was looking for an upgrade was to get the new version of TCP/IP
!services, I miss SSH quite a bit and having telnet open isn't sitting well
!with me. Can I just update the layered product, or do I need to upgrade my
!whole OS?
!
You don't even need to upgrade the TCP/IP stack - just go to the nice folks at
www.process.com, who license their IP stacks (Multinet or TCPware) for hobbyist
use. These stacks have had SSH for quite a while now, and they work with a
_broad_ range of VMS versions.
Apologies to the hp purists here, but no one should have to suffer with an
inferior product for VMS, not even a hobbyist. :-)
!snip! |
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Tom Linden
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 06 May 2002
Posts: 841
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 7:55 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:22:17 -0800, DeanW <dean.woodward@gmail.com> wrote:
| Quote: | On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:02:50 +0000 (UTC), Bradford J. Hamilton
You don't even need to upgrade the TCP/IP stack - just go to the nice
folks at
www.process.com, who license their IP stacks (Multinet or TCPware) for
hobbyist
use. These stacks have had SSH for quite a while now, and they work
with a
_broad_ range of VMS versions.
Supported or not, TCPIP 5.4 runs on 7.2-1 and comes with SSH.
Although I've had more breakin attempts since I opened up SSH
(averaging 4-5 a week) than I've ever had over telnet (um, zero, in 6+
years).
Isn't the basic difference that passwds are transmitted unencrypted with |
telnet? Aside from this, it would seem that breakins have the same
probability of success, independent of whether you use telnet or ssh
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/ |
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DeanW
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 04 Feb 2005
Posts: 28
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 7:22 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:02:50 +0000 (UTC), Bradford J. Hamilton
| Quote: | You don't even need to upgrade the TCP/IP stack - just go to the nice folks at
www.process.com, who license their IP stacks (Multinet or TCPware) for hobbyist
use. These stacks have had SSH for quite a while now, and they work with a
_broad_ range of VMS versions.
|
Supported or not, TCPIP 5.4 runs on 7.2-1 and comes with SSH.
Although I've had more breakin attempts since I opened up SSH
(averaging 4-5 a week) than I've ever had over telnet (um, zero, in 6+
years). |
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