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Bradford J. Hamilton
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 11 Feb 2005
Posts: 6
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 Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 2:50 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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In article <421200e9$1@news.qgraph.com>, "Schroeder, AJ" <aj1@qg.com> writes:
!
!"John Santos" <john@egh.com> wrote in message
!news:rucQd.26452$wc.5294@trnddc07...
!snip!
!> In the past, we have recieved two copies of most Alpha VMS kits, one
!> with our support contract and one as DSPP members. Often when we renew
!> the DSPP membership (annually) we get yet another copy of the latest
!> O/S kit. I bet this is where many of the Ebay kits come from. Most
!> sites really only need one copy. (I do like to keep two, though. It
!> really stinks to discover you've got a scratched CD at 2AM on a Sunday
!> morning in the middle of an upgrade.)
!>
!>
!> --
!> John Santos
!> Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc.
!> 781-861-0670 ext 539
!
!I tried that avenue, unfortunatley my employer is moving away from VMS so
!our subscription is in an unknown status.
!
!So, do they hobbyist licenses work with the latest releases? Or does the
!license from DECUS only work with the version of VMS that comes with the
!hobbyist CD kits? Reason I ask is that I might be able to get 7.3-2 and some
!layered products from my employer, just not the leading edge.
!
The licenses will work with any VMS release AFAIK (I don't know of many
hobbyists running VMS 6.2 and earlier, but I imagine they exist). I've seen
hobbyist sites running on V7.2, V7.2-1, and V7.3.
V7.3-2 should work fine. I currently use V7.3-1, but I have a copy of V7.3-2
ready to go when I feel up to it. I'll probably move to V7.3-2 when updates
and fixes for V7.3-1 stop. I hope I'll have access to V8.2 in the near future,
but I think I can ask folks to lend me a copy, if I need one.
!As you can tell, I am new to VMS and the hobbyist program.
!
Great - I hope you enjoy it! |
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Schroeder, AJ
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Posts: 41
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 3:21 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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"Roy Omond" <Roy.Omond@BlueBubble.UK.Com> wrote in message
news:37efamF59sj30U1@individual.net...
| Quote: | Schroeder, AJ wrote:
[...snip...]
I tried that avenue, unfortunatley my employer is moving away from VMS
so
our subscription is in an unknown status.
So, do they hobbyist licenses work with the latest releases? Or does the
license from DECUS only work with the version of VMS that comes with the
hobbyist CD kits? Reason I ask is that I might be able to get 7.3-2 and
some
layered products from my employer, just not the leading edge.
As you can tell, I am new to VMS and the hobbyist program.
The hobbyist licences are independent of releases.
Since you're new to VMS and the Hobbyist Program, you're forgiven from
the following, ahem, "observation":
Please, in things like this, please specify where you are geographically
located. There are many of us who are more than willing to loan out
CD kits (or even burn a new set if you supply us with blank CDs).
See JF's earlier posting re Canada. I'm willing to do the same in
the UK (and have done so many times already). Good example of
specifying where I am geographically: I'm located near the
town of Saffron Walden in Essex, ca. 16 Km directly south of Cambridge.
Plus, I'm expecting to get my hands on a VMS 8.2 Alpha kit real soon
now.
Roy Omond
Blue Bubble Ltd.
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Thanks, in the future when begging for install media I'll let everyone know.
Speaking of which, if anyone in the US is in the southeastern Wisconsin area
(just outside of Milwaukee, specifically) I would be more than happy to
provide blank CDs and 6-pack of someones favorite beverage for a copy of VMS
8.2 Alpha. |
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johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com
*nix forums Guru Wannabe
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Posts: 195
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 3:45 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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Schroeder, AJ wrote:
| Quote: | Thanks, in the future when begging for install media I'll let
everyone know.
Speaking of which, if anyone in the US is in the southeastern
Wisconsin area
(just outside of Milwaukee, specifically) I would be more than happy
to
provide blank CDs and 6-pack of someones favorite beverage for a copy
of VMS
8.2 Alpha.
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I'll pipe in with a "Me too!" for anyone in the Cincinnati, Ohio area |
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Schroeder, AJ
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Posts: 41
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 6:35 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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"Bradford J. Hamilton" <hamilton@Encompasserve.org> wrote in message
news:cut288$dif$1@grandcanyon.binc.net...
| Quote: | In article <421200e9$1@news.qgraph.com>, "Schroeder, AJ" <aj1@qg.com
writes:
!
!"John Santos" <john@egh.com> wrote in message
!news:rucQd.26452$wc.5294@trnddc07...
!snip!
!> In the past, we have recieved two copies of most Alpha VMS kits, one
!> with our support contract and one as DSPP members. Often when we renew
!> the DSPP membership (annually) we get yet another copy of the latest
!> O/S kit. I bet this is where many of the Ebay kits come from. Most
!> sites really only need one copy. (I do like to keep two, though. It
!> really stinks to discover you've got a scratched CD at 2AM on a Sunday
!> morning in the middle of an upgrade.)
!
!
!> --
!> John Santos
!> Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc.
!> 781-861-0670 ext 539
!
!I tried that avenue, unfortunatley my employer is moving away from VMS so
!our subscription is in an unknown status.
!
!So, do they hobbyist licenses work with the latest releases? Or does the
!license from DECUS only work with the version of VMS that comes with the
!hobbyist CD kits? Reason I ask is that I might be able to get 7.3-2 and
some
!layered products from my employer, just not the leading edge.
!
The licenses will work with any VMS release AFAIK (I don't know of many
hobbyists running VMS 6.2 and earlier, but I imagine they exist). I've
seen
hobbyist sites running on V7.2, V7.2-1, and V7.3.
V7.3-2 should work fine. I currently use V7.3-1, but I have a copy of
V7.3-2
ready to go when I feel up to it. I'll probably move to V7.3-2 when
updates
and fixes for V7.3-1 stop. I hope I'll have access to V8.2 in the near
future,
but I think I can ask folks to lend me a copy, if I need one.
|
The reason I was looking for an upgrade was to get the new version of TCP/IP
services, I miss SSH quite a bit and having telnet open isn't sitting well
with me. Can I just update the layered product, or do I need to upgrade my
whole OS?
| Quote: |
!As you can tell, I am new to VMS and the hobbyist program.
!
Great - I hope you enjoy it!
|
I have enjoyed it so far, it is a bit of a learning curve from *nix, but it
works quite well. I am having fun learning how to hack around on my VMS
system. |
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Chris Scheers
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 13 May 2005
Posts: 44
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 7:05 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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Larry Kilgallen wrote:
| Quote: | In article <cut288$dif$1@grandcanyon.binc.net>, hamilton@Encompasserve.org (Bradford J. Hamilton) writes:
The licenses will work with any VMS release AFAIK (I don't know of many
hobbyists running VMS 6.2 and earlier, but I imagine they exist).
The licenses probably do not work on VMS V5.0 and V5.1.
They certainly do not work prior to VMS V5.0.
|
Then again, they aren't needed prior to VMS 5.0.
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Chris Scheers, Applied Synergy, Inc.
Voice: 817-237-3360 Internet: chris@applied-synergy.com
Fax: 817-237-3074 |
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Larry Kilgallen
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 05 Mar 2005
Posts: 729
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 7:14 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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In article <37f2v8F5d11ivU1@individual.net>, Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com> writes:
| Quote: | Larry Kilgallen wrote:
In article <cut288$dif$1@grandcanyon.binc.net>, hamilton@Encompasserve.org (Bradford J. Hamilton) writes:
The licenses will work with any VMS release AFAIK (I don't know of many
hobbyists running VMS 6.2 and earlier, but I imagine they exist).
The licenses probably do not work on VMS V5.0 and V5.1.
They certainly do not work prior to VMS V5.0.
Then again, they aren't needed prior to VMS 5.0.
|
My MicroVMS 4.x distributions had an extra license element that had
to be applied to get the licensed number of users. |
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DeanW
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 04 Feb 2005
Posts: 28
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 7:22 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:02:50 +0000 (UTC), Bradford J. Hamilton
| Quote: | You don't even need to upgrade the TCP/IP stack - just go to the nice folks at
www.process.com, who license their IP stacks (Multinet or TCPware) for hobbyist
use. These stacks have had SSH for quite a while now, and they work with a
_broad_ range of VMS versions.
|
Supported or not, TCPIP 5.4 runs on 7.2-1 and comes with SSH.
Although I've had more breakin attempts since I opened up SSH
(averaging 4-5 a week) than I've ever had over telnet (um, zero, in 6+
years). |
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Tom Linden
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 06 May 2002
Posts: 841
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 7:55 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:22:17 -0800, DeanW <dean.woodward@gmail.com> wrote:
| Quote: | On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:02:50 +0000 (UTC), Bradford J. Hamilton
You don't even need to upgrade the TCP/IP stack - just go to the nice
folks at
www.process.com, who license their IP stacks (Multinet or TCPware) for
hobbyist
use. These stacks have had SSH for quite a while now, and they work
with a
_broad_ range of VMS versions.
Supported or not, TCPIP 5.4 runs on 7.2-1 and comes with SSH.
Although I've had more breakin attempts since I opened up SSH
(averaging 4-5 a week) than I've ever had over telnet (um, zero, in 6+
years).
Isn't the basic difference that passwds are transmitted unencrypted with |
telnet? Aside from this, it would seem that breakins have the same
probability of success, independent of whether you use telnet or ssh
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/ |
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Bradford J. Hamilton
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 11 Feb 2005
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 8:02 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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In article <42124f20$1@news.qgraph.com>, "Schroeder, AJ" <aj1@qg.com> writes:
!snip!
!
!The reason I was looking for an upgrade was to get the new version of TCP/IP
!services, I miss SSH quite a bit and having telnet open isn't sitting well
!with me. Can I just update the layered product, or do I need to upgrade my
!whole OS?
!
You don't even need to upgrade the TCP/IP stack - just go to the nice folks at
www.process.com, who license their IP stacks (Multinet or TCPware) for hobbyist
use. These stacks have had SSH for quite a while now, and they work with a
_broad_ range of VMS versions.
Apologies to the hp purists here, but no one should have to suffer with an
inferior product for VMS, not even a hobbyist. :-)
!snip! |
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DeanW
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 04 Feb 2005
Posts: 28
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 8:25 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:55:28 -0800, Tom Linden <tom@kednos.com> wrote:
| Quote: | On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:22:17 -0800, DeanW <dean.woodward@gmail.com> wrote:
Supported or not, TCPIP 5.4 runs on 7.2-1 and comes with SSH.
Although I've had more breakin attempts since I opened up SSH
(averaging 4-5 a week) than I've ever had over telnet (um, zero, in 6+
years).
Isn't the basic difference that passwds are transmitted unencrypted with
telnet? Aside from this, it would seem that breakins have the same
probability of success, independent of whether you use telnet or ssh
|
Standard Telnet is open- anyone who plugs a sniffer into any segment
between point A and point B can see/read the traffic. It's
theoretically possible to take over a telnet session from somewhere in
the middle, though I don't know if it's been done in the wild. I do
know a telnet password has been captured via sniffing and used to
break into a system and raise some degree of havoc until they nailed
the hole shut again. (Local small-town ISP that has since disabled
telnet access.)
Our GUI environment uses telnet to communicate with the server, but we
use LGI callouts to verify users, thus avoiding the clear-text
password issue.
I'm guessing the SSH attempts are analogous to script kiddies, looking
for open SSH ports then throwing a list of username/password combos at
it that worked once, somewhere. It'd be interesting to see what
usernames they were trying, but as mentioned in another thread, SSH
doesn't like to give that information. |
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Dave Greenwood
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 27 May 2005
Posts: 25
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 9:25 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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In a previous article, DeanW <dean.woodward@gmail.com> wrote:
| Quote: | On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:55:28 -0800, Tom Linden <tom@kednos.com> wrote:
On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:22:17 -0800, DeanW <dean.woodward@gmail.com> wrote:
Supported or not, TCPIP 5.4 runs on 7.2-1 and comes with SSH.
Although I've had more breakin attempts since I opened up SSH
(averaging 4-5 a week) than I've ever had over telnet (um, zero, in 6+
years).
Isn't the basic difference that passwds are transmitted unencrypted with
telnet? Aside from this, it would seem that breakins have the same
probability of success, independent of whether you use telnet or ssh
Standard Telnet is open- anyone who plugs a sniffer into any segment
between point A and point B can see/read the traffic. It's
theoretically possible to take over a telnet session from somewhere in
the middle, though I don't know if it's been done in the wild. I do
know a telnet password has been captured via sniffing and used to
break into a system and raise some degree of havoc until they nailed
the hole shut again. (Local small-town ISP that has since disabled
telnet access.)
Our GUI environment uses telnet to communicate with the server, but we
use LGI callouts to verify users, thus avoiding the clear-text
password issue.
I'm guessing the SSH attempts are analogous to script kiddies, looking
for open SSH ports then throwing a list of username/password combos at
it that worked once, somewhere. It'd be interesting to see what
usernames they were trying, but as mentioned in another thread, SSH
doesn't like to give that information.
|
A number of successful ssh breakins have been made in the last few
months using trojaned ssh clients. The clients just capture the
keystrokes, including legitimate usernames and passwords. The fact
that ssh encypts everything, not just the passwords, actually makes
it harder for the net cops to detect the resulting breakins.
Dave
--------------
Dave Greenwood Email: Greenwoodde@ORNL.GOV
Oak Ridge National Lab %STD-W-DISCLAIMER, I only speak for myself |
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Dave Froble
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Posts: 1172
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 9:35 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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Larry Kilgallen wrote:
| Quote: | In article <cut288$dif$1@grandcanyon.binc.net>, hamilton@Encompasserve.org (Bradford J. Hamilton) writes:
The licenses will work with any VMS release AFAIK (I don't know of many
hobbyists running VMS 6.2 and earlier, but I imagine they exist).
The licenses probably do not work on VMS V5.0 and V5.1.
They certainly do not work prior to VMS V5.0.
|
If the object is being able to run VMS, then the licenses do work on
versions prior to V5.0. Not saying they actually do anything, but VMS
does run.  |
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JF Mezei
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Posts: 2556
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 9:49 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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Dave Froble wrote:
| Quote: | If the object is being able to run VMS, then the licenses do work on
versions prior to V5.0. Not saying they actually do anything, but VMS
does run.
|
Nop. On my all mighty Microvax II, VMS walks :-)
VMS may need a "key" prior to V 5.0, but applications didn't have any
licencing schemes before that.
One needs to remember that applications coming from post 5.0
environments wouldn't work on pre 5.0 since the image activator would
complain about missing shareable image (and probably lots of ident mismatchs). |
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Chris Scheers
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 13 May 2005
Posts: 44
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 10:15 pm Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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Larry Kilgallen wrote:
| Quote: | In article <37f2v8F5d11ivU1@individual.net>, Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com> writes:
Larry Kilgallen wrote:
In article <cut288$dif$1@grandcanyon.binc.net>, hamilton@Encompasserve.org (Bradford J. Hamilton) writes:
The licenses will work with any VMS release AFAIK (I don't know of many
hobbyists running VMS 6.2 and earlier, but I imagine they exist).
The licenses probably do not work on VMS V5.0 and V5.1.
They certainly do not work prior to VMS V5.0.
Then again, they aren't needed prior to VMS 5.0.
My MicroVMS 4.x distributions had an extra license element that had
to be applied to get the licensed number of users.
|
Under MicroVMS 4.x, licensed users was handled by a version of
LOGINOUT.EXE which was patched for a particular number.
The license element which was distributed was actually an updated
LOGINOUT.EXE.
Actually, the LOGINOUT.EXE from regular VMS also worked very well under
MicroVMS. <grin>
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Chris Scheers, Applied Synergy, Inc.
Voice: 817-237-3360 Internet: chris@applied-synergy.com
Fax: 817-237-3074 |
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Dave Weatherall
*nix forums Guru Wannabe
Joined: 27 Jul 2005
Posts: 108
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| Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 6:03 am Post subject:
Re: OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution
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On Mon, 14 Feb 2005 15:41:37 UTC, "Jeff Goodwin"
<jgoodwin@maine.rrr-r.com> wrote:
| Quote: | My OpenVMS Alpha V8.2 distribution arrived today.
You'll all be happy to know that the box has a Java Compatible logo on it.
:)
-Jeff
|
Ok, I'll bite, what makes a logo Java compatible? )
--
Cheers - Dave W. |
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