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Peter Weaver
*nix forums addict
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Posts: 68
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 Posted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 4:23 pm Post subject:
Re: regular expression support on OpenVMS (was Re: grep on openVMS?)
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Craig A. Berry wrote:
| Quote: | ...
/WILDCARD=TRADITIONAL (D)
/WILDCARD=REGEX
Or, if you prefer, PATTERN instead of WILDCARD. As far as I can see,
there is currently in SEARCH no capability for matching file contents
against patterns of any kind, even traditional VMS wildcards.
...
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V8.2 has added /WILDCARD_MATCHING to SEARCH. Allowing us to use the *
and the % in the search string.
--
Peter Weaver
Weaver Consulting Services Inc.
Canadian VAR for CHARON-VAX
www.weaverconsulting.ca |
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Martin Vorlaender
*nix forums addict
Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 78
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| Posted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 5:12 pm Post subject:
Re: grep on openVMS?
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Bill Gunshannon <bill@cs.uofs.edu> wrote:
| Quote: | "Alex Daniels" <AlexNoSpamDaniels@themail.co.uk> writes:
And UNIX arguments are not even worth a comparison of intuitiveness'
compared to VMS qualifiers.
Again, matter of opinion. It should be noted, however, that this is
changing, even as we speak. More and more Unix commands today have
full word qualifiers as well as the typical single letter one's many
of us ar familiar with and like. :-)
For example:
[cpio with long options snipped] |
But then, you can't abbreviate those on *ix - an awful lot of typing, that.
cu,
Martin
--
| Martin Vorlaender | OpenVMS rules!
Microsoft isn't the Borg: | work: mv@pdv-systeme.de
the Borg have proper | http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martinv/
networking. | home: martin@radiogaga.harz.de |
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prep@prep.synonet.com
*nix forums Guru Wannabe
Joined: 28 Jul 2005
Posts: 190
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| Posted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 6:53 pm Post subject:
Re: grep on openVMS?
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Z <Z@no.spam> writes:
| Quote: | How often do you use the word SUBMIT when talking about something you
need to do in the future?
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Only when I put a /AFTER at the end of the sentance.
--
Paul Repacholi 1 Crescent Rd.,
+61 (0 9257-1001 Kalamunda.
West Australia 6076
comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot
Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.
EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be. |
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JF Mezei
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Posts: 2556
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| Posted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 8:30 pm Post subject:
Re: grep on openVMS?
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| Quote: | How often do you use the word SUBMIT when talking about something you
need to do in the future?
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When you submit some paperwork to some government organisation for
processing  |
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Larry Kilgallen
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 05 Mar 2005
Posts: 729
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| Posted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 9:45 pm Post subject:
Re: grep on openVMS?
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In article <7BUPd.1454$6o.1155@fe07.lga>, Z <Z@no.spam> writes:
| Quote: | Really?
How often do you use the word SUBMIT when talking about something you
need to do in the future?
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I use it mainly for something someone _else_ needs (in my opinion)
to do in the future. This month I need to submit my passport renewal. |
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Larry Kilgallen
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 05 Mar 2005
Posts: 729
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| Posted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 9:49 pm Post subject:
Re: grep on openVMS?
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In article <1110flaef3srr2a@corp.supernews.com>, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes:
| Quote: | Larry Kilgallen wrote:
Devil's advocate - "CHANGE DIRECTORY" is much more intuitive here.
If so, do you know of an operating system which provides a command
called CHANGE DIRECTORY ?
I'm going to reverse my earlier claim that all DCL verbs are better than
the unix commands. Well, somewhat.
What you're doing is changing the default directory, and CHANGE
DIRECTORY is quite defining. As for the fact that it's just CD on most
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No, it makes it seem like I am changing a directory. I am not changing
any directory. A SHA-1 checksum of the directory will prove that. Even
looking at the file header for the directory will show there was no change.
The directory is unchanged. The only thing that has changed is my default
choice of directory.
| Quote: | systems, well, how about a show of hands of those who do NOT have a
symbol SD as a shortcut for SET DEFAULT.
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Certainly I do not.
| Quote: | And yes, BACKUP is a computereze word, and not really real clear to an
english speaker.
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That is good, since the BACKUP syntax is so obscure it should not be
attempted lightly. |
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David J Dachtera
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 26 Jun 2005
Posts: 1067
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 12:24 am Post subject:
Re: grep on openVMS?
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Larry Kilgallen wrote:
| Quote: |
In article <A0OPd.1312$wt4.38@fe07.lga>, Z <Z@no.spam> writes:
David J Dachtera wrote:
"rm" ... "DELETE"
"vi" ... "EDIT"
"cd" ... "SET DEFAULT"
"ls" ... "DIRECTORY"
"tar" ... "BACKUP"
"cat" ... "TYPE"
"man" ... "HELP"
"ps" ... "SHOW SYSTEM"
"lpr" ... "PRINT"
"at" ... "SUBMIT"
(Guess you can tell that at some point I just looked at my HELP display
and picked out some of the more obviously "intuitive" UN*X-land
commands, eh? ;-)
Again, the VMS commands are more meaningful to you only because of your
past VMS experience.
No, actually the VMS commands are more meaningful due to past experience
with the English language. Those from some countries might not find that
helpful, but unless David has been fooling us all this time, he is from
the United States.
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Da, Comrade!
--
David J Dachtera
dba DJE Systems
http://www.djesys.com/
Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:
http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/
Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:
http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/
Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page:
http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/
Coming soon:
Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page |
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David J Dachtera
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 26 Jun 2005
Posts: 1067
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 12:28 am Post subject:
Re: grep on openVMS?
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Z wrote:
| Quote: |
Bradford J. Hamilton wrote:
In the VMS world, we know the difference between COPY and BACKUP, but
explaining the difference to an outsider is somewhat counter-intuitive. How
about REPLICATE to replace BACKUP? COPY would retain its "current" meaning...
One more: "BACKUP" as the command for restoring data is counterintuitive.
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Yes and no.
It is generally understood that the first "token" on a command line is a
program name in the non-VMS world, expect of course for shell/cli
built-ins like cd, pwd, echo, etc. Given that, even using tar for both
"backup" and "restore" would likewise be "counter intuitive".
....but certainly no more so than those wonderful, one-character command
line options, eh? ;-)
--
David J Dachtera
dba DJE Systems
http://www.djesys.com/
Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:
http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/
Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:
http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/
Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page:
http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/
Coming soon:
Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page |
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Craig A. Berry
*nix forums Guru Wannabe
Joined: 27 May 2005
Posts: 143
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 12:38 am Post subject:
Re: regular expression support on OpenVMS (was Re: grep on openVMS?)
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In article <37c554F5bvirtU1@individual.net>,
"Peter Weaver" <WeaverConsultingServices@sympatico.ca> wrote:
| Quote: | Craig A. Berry wrote:
...
/WILDCARD=TRADITIONAL (D)
/WILDCARD=REGEX
Or, if you prefer, PATTERN instead of WILDCARD. As far as I can see,
there is currently in SEARCH no capability for matching file contents
against patterns of any kind, even traditional VMS wildcards.
...
V8.2 has added /WILDCARD_MATCHING to SEARCH. Allowing us to use the *
and the % in the search string.
|
Nifty. I was not aware of this. Still looks like a good place to drop
in regular expressions as an alternative to traditional wildcards. |
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Anthony Borla
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 21 Feb 2005
Posts: 18
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 2:29 am Post subject:
Re: regular expression support on OpenVMS (was Re: grep on openVMS?)
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"Peter Weaver" <WeaverConsultingServices@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:37c554F5bvirtU1@individual.net...
| Quote: | Craig A. Berry wrote:
...
/WILDCARD=TRADITIONAL (D)
/WILDCARD=REGEX
Or, if you prefer, PATTERN instead of WILDCARD. As
far as I can see, there is currently in SEARCH no capability
for matching file contents against patterns of any kind, even
traditional VMS wildcards.
...
V8.2 has added /WILDCARD_MATCHING to SEARCH.
Allowing us to use the * and the % in the search string.
|
Definitely a move in the right direction, and good to see progress being
made !
Cheers,
Anthony Borla |
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Bob Koehler
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 1078
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 1:00 pm Post subject:
Re: grep on openVMS?
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In article <ILAPd.236$cn3.82@fe07.lga>, Z <Z@no.spam> writes:
| Quote: | The same is true for plenty of VMS commands, qualifiers and also layered
product commands. You just don't see it that way because of decades of
VMS exposure.
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Right, nobody would ever think of using "PRINT" to print a file,
"SEARCH" to search it, or "/LOG" to mean the same thing on every
command that has it. |
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Bob Koehler
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 1078
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 1:02 pm Post subject:
Re: grep on openVMS?
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In article <A0OPd.1312$wt4.38@fe07.lga>, Z <Z@no.spam> writes:
| Quote: | I find it telling that you compare SUBMIT and at... consider why you
think "SUBMIT" makes more sense than "at" for runnng a task at some time
in the future and then go ask some one who doesn't know Unix or VMS
which command they think makes more sense.
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Which only goes to show that even UNIX can't get it wrong every time.
Except that SUBMIT does not require "some time in the future". |
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Bob Koehler
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 1078
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 1:03 pm Post subject:
Re: grep on openVMS?
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In article <1108346839.34146d4f8a683082b835bdf2db61de6d@teranews>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes:
| Quote: | out of curiosity, what does "dog" do in Unix ????
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That, of course, depends on which UNIX you bought. Unless you
install gdog, which of course also runs on VMS. |
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Bob Koehler
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 1078
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 1:05 pm Post subject:
Re: grep on openVMS?
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In article <1110flaef3srr2a@corp.supernews.com>, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes:
| Quote: |
What you're doing is changing the default directory, and CHANGE
DIRECTORY is quite defining. As for the fact that it's just CD on most
systems, well, how about a show of hands of those who do NOT have a
symbol SD as a shortcut for SET DEFAULT.
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You have a UNIX shell which implements "change directory"? All mine
know only the cryptic "cd". |
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Bill Gunshannon
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Posts: 1019
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| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 1:07 pm Post subject:
Re: grep on openVMS?
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In article <4210e9f3.524144494f47414741@radiogaga.harz.de>,
martin@radiogaga.harz.de (Martin Vorlaender) writes:
| Quote: | Bill Gunshannon <bill@cs.uofs.edu> wrote:
"Alex Daniels" <AlexNoSpamDaniels@themail.co.uk> writes:
And UNIX arguments are not even worth a comparison of intuitiveness'
compared to VMS qualifiers.
Again, matter of opinion. It should be noted, however, that this is
changing, even as we speak. More and more Unix commands today have
full word qualifiers as well as the typical single letter one's many
of us ar familiar with and like. :-)
For example:
[cpio with long options snipped]
But then, you can't abbreviate those on *ix - an awful lot of typing, that.
|
Boy, you just can't win. First they were too short, now there are
no abbreviations.
Actually, you are free to continue to use the original one letter
options, but the long one's are also available for those who want
the exercise for their fingers.
bill
--
Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves
bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
University of Scranton |
Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include <std.disclaimer.h> |
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