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tomarsin2015@comcast.net
*nix forums addict
Joined: 08 Feb 2005
Posts: 54
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 Posted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 5:32 am Post subject:
Re: update SCSI to IDE bridge
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It will work - I guess read the instructions first. I got the Acard
Tech AEC-7720U to work
with the Seagate drive on the lowest end VAX. The VAX is running a bare
bones V7.3
with no patches etc
AURIGA> show dev dkb500/full
Disk $53$DKB500: (AURIGA), device type ST33232A, is online,
file-oriented
device, shareable, error logging is enabled.
Error count 0 Operations completed
0
Owner process "" Owner UIC
[SYSTEM]
Owner process ID 00000000 Dev Prot
S:RWPL,O:RWPL,G:R,W
Reference count 0 Default buffer size
512
Allocation class 53
AURIGA>
AURIGA> init dkb500: test
AURIGA> mount/system dkb500: test
%MOUNT-I-MOUNTED, TEST mounted on _$53$DKB500: (AURIGA)
AURIGA> show dev dkb500/full
Disk $53$DKB500: (AURIGA), device type ST33232A, is online, mounted,
file-
oriented device, shareable, error logging is enabled.
Error count 0 Operations completed
98
Owner process "" Owner UIC
[SYSTEM]
Owner process ID 00000000 Dev Prot
S:RWPL,O:RWPL,G:R,W
Reference count 1 Default buffer size
512
Total blocks 6303024 Sectors per track
63
Total cylinders 6253 Tracks per cylinder
16
Allocation class 53
Volume label "TEST" Relative volume number
0
Cluster size 7 Transaction count
1
Free blocks 6302639 Maximum files allowed
393939
Extend quantity 5 Mount count
1
Mount status System Cache name
"_$53$DKB0:XQPCACHE"
Extent cache size 64 Maximum blocks in extent cache
630263
File ID cache size 64 Blocks currently in extent
cache 0
Quota cache size 0 Maximum buffers in FCP cache
550
Volume owner UIC [SYSTEM] Vol Prot
S:RWCD,O:RWCD,G:RWCD,W:RWCD
Volume Status: ODS-2, subject to mount verification, file high-water
marking,
write-back caching enabled.
AURIGA>
I was able to copy and delete files without the system/drive having
problems. The only problem with this card is the size. Knowing that the
card will work in a 3100 the next
project is to go ahead and try the card/drive with the CMD 22X scsi
qbus controller and
a few other MTI disk only controllers. The CMD controller does have a
RS232 port and
the test system will be a VAX 4000-500 runing 7.3 and all the patches
for 7.3.
phil |
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Hoff Hoffman
*nix forums Guru
Joined: 22 Jul 2005
Posts: 572
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| Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2006 1:03 pm Post subject:
Re: update SCSI to IDE bridge
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nnc@eta.chalmers.se wrote:
| Quote: | May I guess that this is a problem of sector size !?
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Maybe.
| Quote: | VAX:es usually requires 512 byte sectors on disc, as opposed to most
modern computers (PC:s etc.) that works on 256 byte sectors.
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Eh? I've not seen a 256-byte sector size in a device over the last
half-eon or so, everything I've seen and worked with in the past decade
is using 512 or 2048 byte sectors, and 4096 sectors are just starting to
come on-line. The most recent devices I can recall with 256 byte
sectors I can recall are the RX01 floppy disk, and the TU58 DECtape II
-- and both are, um, rather old.
Alpha, VAX, Integrity all use 512, all PC systems I've encountered
this side of Windows Vista also use and default to 512 byte sector sizes
for magnetic disks. (Vista reportedly adds the larger 4096 sector size,
something that is coming into the storage device product pipeline.
AFAIK, OpenVMS doesn't have immediate plans to add this variant sector
size. I don't personally expect any storage vendors to rush to create
devices that exclusively support 4096 byte sector size interfaces and
not the long-standing 512; I expect that there to be an overlap where
devices support both 512 and 4096, or one device with two different
firmware profiles.)
Systems back from TOPS vintage and some variants of disks commonly
seen on VAX systems did have some odd sector sizes, though the VAX
systems used 512. A few of the disks had error correction in addition
to the data, and these had larger sector sizes at lower levels, but the
host-visible data size was 512.
| Quote: | Compare this problem to the very few CD brands that might be hooked on
the SCSI-bus of a Vax - and for these, a jumper has to be moved to tell
the drive to work in 512 Byte mode!
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This would be the 2048 byte sector size of CD and DVD media, and CD
and DVD devices that support 512-byte transfers (the native VAX size) do
work, where CD and DVD devices can and do default to 2048 byte sector
sizes. This was/is SCSI, as there wasn't blocking and deblocking of
2048 byte sectors. IDE disks in particular are all 2048, which would
mean that all devices that convert these over to SCSI also need to block
and deblock these into 512 byte units to get this configuration to work
via SCSI.
The Alpha and the Integrity driver stack has similar requirements for
SCSI devices. Like VAX, these devices also expect 512 byte sectors.
(There has been engineering work to add 2048 byte sectors into the
64-bit platform SCSI driver stack, but I don't know off-hand when or if
that will be enabled or supported; most certainly not before V8.3, and
quite possibly later if at all, and the devices and platform to be
determined. The Alpha and Integrity IDE/ATAPI stack does have 2048
deblocking support (it can make a native 2048 byte sector look like the
four 512-byte blocks that OpenVMS expects), but -- unless you're looking
at one of my side-builds -- it does not have blocking support.
| Quote: | Happy trying, and please reconfigure the bridge, if possble,
thereafter, tell the result to the list!
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That the bridge works for Alpha and not for VAX makes me wonder if
it's something else. There are ECO kits for SCSI disk sizes, for
instance, and I don't know off-hand if the VAX consoles can deal with
the command sets on newer disks. (The defaults on newer disks have
certainly derailed a few SRM consoles, for instance -- the AlphaStation
XP1000 cannot bootstrap from a number of ATAPI devices, for instance.
The Plextor PX716A is one of the few new devices that does work and does
boot via the SRM on the AlphaStation XP1000 series.) Check the OpenVMS
FAQ for the specific SCSI ECO kits that are required for larger SCSI
disks, as these ATA devices (via the bridge) do (obviously) present as
SCSI devices. |
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Roger Ivie
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 02 Mar 2005
Posts: 31
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| Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2006 2:37 am Post subject:
Re: update SCSI to IDE bridge
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On 2006-07-17, nnc@eta.chalmers.se <nnc@eta.chalmers.se> wrote:
| Quote: | May I guess that this is a problem of sector size !?
VAX:es usually requires 512 byte sectors on disc, as opposed to most
modern computers (PC:s etc.) that works on 256 byte sectors.
Compare this problem to the very few CD brands that might be hooked on
the SCSI-bus of a Vax - and for these, a jumper has to be moved to tell
the drive to work in 512 Byte mode!
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For hard disks, both VAX and PC (and everyone else) are 512 bytes.
For CD/DVD, VAX is 512 bytes and the rest of the world is 2048.
--
roger ivie
rivie@ridgenet.net |
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sm6nnc
*nix forums beginner
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 5
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 10:49 pm Post subject:
Re: update SCSI to IDE bridge
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May I guess that this is a problem of sector size !?
VAX:es usually requires 512 byte sectors on disc, as opposed to most
modern computers (PC:s etc.) that works on 256 byte sectors.
Compare this problem to the very few CD brands that might be hooked on
the SCSI-bus of a Vax - and for these, a jumper has to be moved to tell
the drive to work in 512 Byte mode!
Happy trying, and please reconfigure the bridge, if possble,
thereafter, tell the result to the list!
/G. I. Åhling
healyzh@aracnet.com wrote:
| Quote: | tomarsin2015@comcast.net wrote:
able to see the drive. No matter what bridge I used the VAXs will not see
the drive. I was thinking of trying the bridges on a CMD 22X qbus scsi
controller, but with the luck I am having with the VAX I may not even try
it. I was really hoping they would work on the VAX. If anything does work
on a VAX I will post the results.
I for one would be really interested in knowing if the CMD controller will
see the drive. Does the controller support the ability to hook a serial
terminal up to it and see what is connected?
I'm more than a little suprised that you're unable to see the drives on the
VAXen. Is this from the hardware prompt, or from VMS? If from VMS, what
version?
Zane |
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healyzh@aracnet.com
*nix forums Guru Wannabe
Joined: 10 Aug 2005
Posts: 116
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 5:26 pm Post subject:
Re: update SCSI to IDE bridge
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tomarsin2015@comcast.net wrote:
| Quote: | able to see the drive. No matter what bridge I used the VAXs will not see
the drive. I was thinking of trying the bridges on a CMD 22X qbus scsi
controller, but with the luck I am having with the VAX I may not even try
it. I was really hoping they would work on the VAX. If anything does work
on a VAX I will post the results.
|
I for one would be really interested in knowing if the CMD controller will
see the drive. Does the controller support the ability to hook a serial
terminal up to it and see what is connected?
I'm more than a little suprised that you're unable to see the drives on the
VAXen. Is this from the hardware prompt, or from VMS? If from VMS, what
version?
Zane |
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tomarsin2015@comcast.net
*nix forums addict
Joined: 08 Feb 2005
Posts: 54
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| Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 1:05 am Post subject:
update SCSI to IDE bridge
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Hello
I received two scsi to ide bridges. They are a Hoei Precision iXT/S and
a Acard Tech
AEC-7720U models. For the test I tried a Seagate st33232a (3.2 gigs)
ide drive. The
test systems are a VAX 4000-100, a VAX 3100-40 and 95 and a
AlphaStation 200/233
all running VMS 7.3. The AlphaStation had no problem seeing and int the
drive. The Alpha
treated the drive just like it was a regular scsi drive - no mess. So
far no VAX has been
able to see the drive. No matter what bridge I used the VAXs will not
see the drive. I was
thinking of trying the bridges on a CMD 22X qbus scsi controller, but
with the luck I am
having with the VAX I may not even try it. I was really hoping they
would work on the VAX.
If anything does work on a VAX I will post the results. |
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